Lisa A. Romano is a Certified Life Coach who specializes in codependency and narcissistic abuse. Through her personal struggles, she has found a way out of the confusion a codependent mind can be. She is a best-selling author, YouTuber, and was voted the number one most influential person of 2020 by Digital Journal.This article is an excerpt from Carrie Ann’s Jan.27th, 2022 Instagram Live conversation with Lisa A. Romano. The interview has been edited for length and clarity. The word narcissism gets flung out quite frequently these days, along with other psychological buzzwords like gaslighting and trauma. It’s wonderful that we now have the language to identify these traits and situations, and the ability to share that information through social media. However, it’s important to understand what true narcissism and narcissistic abuse looks like. What role do they play in relationships? How does codependency create the environment for a narcissist to thrive? Carrie Ann caught up with life coach Lisa A. Romano, who specializes in helping people heal from narcissistic abuse and codependency. She has personal experience with both, and gave insight into why these types of relationships form. We hope you learn something new from this conversation, and can take something positive away for your own healing journey – whatever that may be.Carrie Ann: Let’s talk about relationships. In my past I have been in some very unhealthy relationships and attracted narcissists. It’s also brought out my own narcissistic tendencies. But, I think I relate more with being a codependent empath and having an anxious attachment style. Why does this happen? How does this narcissist codependent attraction happen? Why is it so prevalent in our society?
Lisa A. Romano: Empaths and codependents are different. An empath is like a sponge. An empath will pick up on the wounds of a narcissist, and immediately want to fix and heal them. Empaths are highly forgiving – they know that people are flawed – so they give people a pass. A narcissist says “Carrie Ann, I heard you. I’m so sorry. I’m going to work on that”. That fills you with joy. It makes the empath in you feel like a true healer, like you really can help this person. An empath can understand and even empathize with why the narcissist is abusive. Such as, “well, he abuses me because his father was an alcoholic”. They have this level of empathy for someone who’s narcissistic, and that’s exactly what a narcissist needs. A narcissist needs someone with high compassion. A narcissist requires it. A narcissist needs someone who says “that’s okay babe, I understand you made some mistake. As long as you’re working on yourself, that’s great, we can move towards this”.
A codependent is someone who needs to be needed. They are someone who does not have a sense of self, so they get one by catering to someone who is self-focused. A narcissist does not know how to navigate the world without direction. A narcissist oftentimes appears to be someone who has a lot of a lot of wounds and a codependent says, “I can fix that”. And they get a sense of self from fixing the narcissist. So, they’re not the same thing. However, an empath can have codependent traits and a codependent can be highly empathic.
Carrie Ann: That’s the part that trips everybody up, I think. That nothing’s quite black and white, right?
Lisa A. Romano: No.
Carrie Ann: You mentioned that empaths can sense the trauma in a narcissist. My theory is that empaths and narcissists come from the same sort of trauma, a trauma so immense that they just couldn’t deal with it and stay balanced. For me as the empath, I became hyper sensitive and developed my “spidey” skills. I sort of went outward in order to survive. And in my experience, the narcissist has the same kind of trauma. Maybe they’re scared as a child, so they go inward for survival. They only think about the self. There is nobody that exists that is as important as the self, because it’s their survival mode. Am I way off on this or is there some truth here?
Lisa A. Romano: There’s new research suggesting that narcissism is on the rise, and the researchers have an inkling that social media has something to do with that. This idea that this generation has a platform to celebrate themselves and to gain a source of narcissistic supply, right? That’s one theory. But it is more commonly known that narcissists do suffer from terrible trauma. They go so far inside themselves that they develop a false narrative, and a false self. So they really do think that they’re better than you. They really do believe that.
What they need you to do, if you’re going to be in a relationship with them, is to reflect that back. “Oh, babe you’re awesome. Oh, you’re amazing. Oh, no one’s as smart as you. It’s okay, you didn’t mean to go out drinking and crash the car and get three DUIs. It’s not your fault”. They need that. They need someone to mirror that back. That prevents them from feeling vulnerable. They see vulnerability in someone else as a weakness, and they feel entitled to exploit someone who has vulnerability.
Carrie Ann: Oh, I see. So that’s perfect as an empath. What people maybe don’t recognize is as empaths we’re not only vulnerable, we’re also highly intuitive. I think what I’ve learned from listening to you is that it’s really important to listen to the deeper self that actually does know how to take care of you. What is good advice for an empath so that they don’t choose another narcissist? How can they create a boundary?
Lisa A. Romano: This is why I talk so much about what codependency symptoms feel and look like, because I didn’t know that I was a codependent, yet I was. When I started to research, I realized that I knew what it felt like. Then I saw codependency in almost everyone. People need to know that sometimes trying to control a person is codependent. Maybe you just bought a person a beautiful bridal shower gift and you’re pissed off because it’s not all over Instagram – that’s codependency. You’re looking for a sense of self in this person celebrating you. You want to be recognized, noticed. You’re doing things because you need to feel like you’re seen by others. That’s not good, right? What we have to do first is recognize who we are. How do we show up in relationships? Am I attracting narcissists? Well, I’m the common denominator. None of these men know each other.
Carrie Ann: Right? I was like, oh, it’s me.
Lisa A. Romano: Right? None of these people knew each other! They lived in different zip codes. So I had to get real with myself and say, “oh my God, this is me”. You have to identify. You have to take stock of that. And then you have to recognize why you’re doing it, because it’s not your fault.
If you’re an empath, you can be one with no codependent tendencies and still absorb the energies of other people, because it’s natural for you. You process the world through the emotional body. It’s just the way you were born. Some people believe that empaths are created because of the trauma, and I believe there’s truth in that. I think the one of the reasons I have so much empathy is because I experienced such little empathy in my life. I couldn’t imagine bullying someone because I was bullied. I couldn’t imagine hurting someone and inflicting on them what I experienced.
As a codependent and as an empath, you have to recognize who you are, and pay attention to yourself and how you show up. Then you have to develop grounding techniques, and understand what a codependent thought is and what it’s not. You have to know what your intentions are. You have to self-love, and you need boundaries.
Carrie Ann: There’s so much incredible information here, but one of the things that stands out to me is if you notice yourself looking for your value from others, that’s where you have to be careful.
We hope that through this conversation we have demystified and clarified a few of the buzzwords that you’ve seen in the self-help world. Lisa has such a depth of knowledge in this area, and many resources to check out if you’re interested in hearing more! She has meditations on Insight Timer, as well as several books. Links to more information on Lisa are below!
For more information and resources on Lisa A. Romano, view the links below: Her websiteHer 12 week courseHer books – “I suggest you read my books in the following order,: The Road Back To Me, My Road Beyond the Codependent Divorce, Codependent Now What? It’s Not You-It’s Your Programming, Quantum Tools To Help You Heal Your Life Now, and Loving The Self Affirmations 1 & 2.” – Lisa A. Romano
How many times have you hit the pillow at night only to stare at the ceiling in a whirlwind of unproductive thoughts for another two hours? You said you’d go to bed at 10pm, but your mind can’t stop reviewing that one comment you made in a meeting or that presentation you have tomorrow. Those sticky “what if” thoughts can ruminate in your brain and make falling asleep easily seem wholly unattainable. The off switch is nowhere in sight, so frustration and stress set in. Now you’re in panic mode because you know you have to get to sleep soon. You’re worse off than when you got into bed an hour ago.
It can feel like an endless cycle, but researchers have tackled this phenomenon in order to bring us solutions. Barring sleeping pills, which have their own risks, there are several practical methods that can aid in creating an environment and mindset conducive to sleep. You might already do a few of these, however, they work best together. Buying black out curtains and calling it a day won’t solve insomnia, but using these tools together in conjunction with other self-care habits just might.
The Basics
If you’re a sleep hygiene newbie, checking off a list of “must haves” is an essential way to start to improve your routine. According to the CDC, “adults need 7 or more hours of sleep per night for the best health and wellbeing”. You probably already know this. Nevertheless, it’s likely you often fall short of this, as “a third of US adults report that they usually get less than the recommended amount of sleep” (CDC). Research has suggested that there are a few non-negotiables when it comes to getting a good night’s rest, and these are the first steps to getting that full 7.
What you can do during the day
Get adequate exercise
Get direct exposure to sunlight daily, especially in the mornings – Bright light, or ideally exposure to direct sunlight, helps to keep your circadian rhythm in balance. It signals to your body that it’s time to wake up.
Wake up at the same time every morning – Consistency is key. If you sleep in until 11am one day and wake up at 7am the next, your schedule is inevitably thrown off.
Eat meals at the same time every day – Again, consistency is key, even with digestion. Keeping your body on a schedule will set you up for sleep.
Limit caffeine in the afternoon – Resisting that afternoon pick me up may be difficult, but you’ll thank yourself later when you’re actually tired at bedtime.
Limit alcohol consumption – Having a glass of wine while you watch Bridgerton is probably fine, just don’t go overboard.
Keep your bed for sleeping – Meaning don’t do work and take meetings from it.
Take a nap if you need to – There’s no shame in a power nap! It’s recommended not to nap too late in the afternoon though, as this could further mess with your sleep schedule.
Make your room as peaceful as possible – Pick out décor, sheets, pillows, etc. with this in mind. Maybe invest in a humidifier, sound machine, or an essential oil diffuser. Anything that makes you feel most at peace.
View our Amazon list of recommended sleep friendly products HERE!
What you can do right before bed
Keep your bedtime consistent – It can be extremely tempting to have a late night, especially when you don’t get much free time. But if you know that will mess you up in the morning, at least limit it to the weekends.
Start winding down 30 mins to an hour before bed – This can consist of anything that helps you to relax. Meditate, listen to a sleep story, read a book (nothing too gripping though), do a 16 step skincare routine, write in a journal, take a bath, listen to a spa playlist, do a puzzle – whatever your heart desires.
Keep lights in your home or apartment dim – Just like bright sunlight ques your brain to wake up, dim light lets it know that it’s time to sleep.
Make sure your room is dark when you get into bed – Get blackout curtains if you need to, and cover up any light sources (even covering that tiny blue light emanating from your power strip can help).
Limit blue light (AKA your cell phone, laptop, or TV) the hour before bedtime – if you have to work late or can’t resist TikTok, put your devices on night mode. This yellows the screen and gives your eyes a break. An alternative is to buy blue light glasses.
Keep your room cool or at a temperature that is most comfortable to you
If you live on a busy street or have noisy neighbors, consider ear plugs or a sound machine
If you’ve been trying some of these methods but aren’t seeing results, the CDC recommends starting a sleep journal as a first line of defense. Write down your daily habits for a week – what time you went to bed / woke up, when you ate, what you ate, caffeine consumption, alcohol consumption, etc. This can help to reveal patterns and narrow down what isn’t working.
I’ve got my habits down, but I can’t stop beating myself up when they don’t work
One of the most infuriating side effects of sleep problems is how cognizant you are of the importance of sleep. How could you not be? You’ve set up a full routine of habits to get some much needed REM. On nights when that routine fails, you’re all too aware of it. Luckily, this is a frequent problem among the sleepless and researchers have come up with methods to solve it.
One common tool that even therapists use to combat this kind of thinking is called paradoxical intention. In general, paradoxical intention is “a psychotherapeutic technique […] in which the individual is asked to magnify a distressing, unwanted symptom” and aims to “help such individuals distance themselves from their symptoms, often by appreciating the humorous aspects of their exaggerated responses” (American Psychological Association). In treating insomnia, employing paradoxical intention means to avoid efforts to fall asleep. The “unwanted symptom” is not being able to fall asleep, and by engaging in the opposite – trying to stay awake – the performance anxiety you have has the opportunity to diminish.
Paradoxical Intention doesn’t mean you get into bed and do all the wrong things – like staring at a screen. It is used in combination with your regular techniques and routines. It’s the process of letting go of the fear of not sleeping, and releasing the guilt you may feel around it. Here are a few ways to put this method to work:
When you get into bed, instead of focusing on trying to fall asleep, try to stay awake. Keep your eyes open as long as you can. You might find that sleep comes easier when you’re trying to do the opposite.
Learn to be at peace with quiet, or passive, wakefulness. It’s okay to be in bed, resting with your eyes closed. At least you are resting. Try to move your thoughts away from why you can’t sleep, and focus on simply relaxing.
If you can’t sleep, get up. Move to a different room or somewhere that is not your bed. Start a relaxation technique, like a guided meditation, or read a boring book. This will help occupy your mind until you become sleepy.
I’ve tried it all – now what?
If you’re at the point where basic sleep hygiene isn’t cutting it, don’t worry. If your insomnia is severe enough, it’s time to visit your doctor. Sleep problems can be a sign of underlying conditions, so it’s important to get that checked before anything else. Some medical and therapeutic interventions include:
Sleep Studies: Your primary care physician can refer you to a doctor that specializes in sleep medicine. Sleep studies can rule out sleep apnea or anything happening neurologically.
Depression Treatment: Insomnia can be a symptom of depression, especially if you are a woman. According to the Sleep Foundation, “women are diagnosed with depression at higher rates than men, and sleeping too much or too little is a frequent symptom of that disorder. Studies have also found that women are more likely to ruminate about their concerns, which can contribute to anxiety, limiting one’s ability to fall asleep easily”.
Cognitive Behavioral Therapy (CBT): If you’ve gotten the all clear physically, one option is to try CBT, which is one of the most common types of talk therapy. The Mayo Clinic defines CBT for insomnia as “a structured program that helps you identify and replace thoughts and behaviors that cause or worsen sleep problems with habits that promote sound sleep. Unlike sleeping pills, CBT-I helps you overcome the underlying causes of your sleep problems”.
Sleep is essential, not a luxury. It’s easy to fall into the trap of consistently working late to prove something to yourself or to others. But you are the only one that can take care of you. Not to mention, your work quality and overall health can falter when you’re not getting enough sleep. If you’re struggling, it’s worth it to take the time to adjust whatever needs adjusting, especially if you tend to ruminate and can’t mentally cut ties with the day. There’s so much help out there, and it’s just waiting for you to take the first step. You deserve a good night’s rest.
Jane Massengill is a master certified coach and licensed social worker. She found coaching over 20 years ago when she was working with a group of psychiatrists who were exploring and expanding treatment for adults with Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder. A new profession in its infancy, coaching was exactly what Jane was looking for to bridge the gap between the internal personal growth work she was doing as a therapist and the external restructuring her clients needed with daily challenges such as getting to work on time, keeping a daily schedule or creating an exercise routine. She quickly fell into being among a small group of professionals in the country who had experience as a therapist with the training of a coach, plus years of work with adults with ADHD in a clinic setting. It put her in a unique position to write a chapter on ADD Coaching in Dr. Daniel Amen’s New York Times bestselling book, Healing ADD, and to participate in creating the first set of guidelines for ADD Coaches for the newly formed Adult Attention Deficit Disorder Association.
This article is an excerpt from Carrie Ann’s March 3rd, 2022 Instagram Live conversation with Jane Massengill. It has been edited for length and clarity.
While ADHD (Attention-deficit / hyperactivity Disorder) is a fairly new type of mental diagnosis (it wasn’t recognized by the American Psychiatric Association until the 1960’s, and the “hyperactivity” component was not added until the 1980’s), it is also one of the most common. Many of us are related to someone, or at least know an individual with ADHD, yet a stigma still seems to shroud the disorder. When we imagine someone with ADHD, a lot of us picture that busy boy in class that can’t sit still. The truth is that ADHD has many faces, which is why it can often get missed in childhood. Many people do not even realize they have the disorder until their own children are diagnosed and they connect the dots. This is especially true for women, who don’t always present with that stereotypical case of hyperactivity. If you’re unfamiliar with the disorder or simply curious to learn more, we were lucky enough to have Carrie Ann’s personal ADHD coach, Jane Massengill, dispel common misconceptions and share her own story.
Carrie Ann: On our on our first episode of “Carrie Ann Conversations: Journey to Wellness”, I spoke with Dr. Daniel Amen and shared my ADHD diagnosis. It was Dr. Amen who referred me to you, and suggested I speak with you. Can you share with everyone how you started working with ADHD patients? And how an ADHD coach is different from a life coach?
Jane Massengill: Great question. It’s really interesting, I was thinking about this this morning. When I first started out as a social worker in the early 80s, there was no such thing as adult ADHD. It was really just a diagnosis and kids. I ended up meeting Dr. Amen when I moved to California, because I wanted to work with a psychiatrist and work with families. So at the time, the only thing we had was the Yellow Pages. I called every psychiatrist in the Yellow Pages and Amen begins with A, so I met him the next day. Dan hired me on the spot. He had actually just finished his residency, so he had just started his practice. So we started working together in the late 80s, and were seeing a lot of parents that had kids with ADHD. Right around that same time, Dan started doing brain imaging, and I volunteered to have a scan. Through that process, I learned about my own ADHD.
Carrie Ann: Wait, is that the first time that you realized you had ADHD?
Jane Massengill: Absolutely. Yeah, I was doing all of these evaluations with people at the Amen clinic. I had left the clinic for about four years when my kids were really little. When I came back, Dan was doing these scans and he needed a bunch of people with healthy brains to volunteer. After the diagnosis, I remember thinking, this just makes so much sense. He said he didn’t expect it, but he didn’t see a lot of my own struggles that weren’t showing up in the workplace. He didn’t see the stuff in the background, you know, what my piles looked like at home and how I worked really hard to just try to keep it together. So it was such a relief to me when I had that diagnosis. I think it is for most people, Carrie Ann I think you said earlier that it helped you connect the dots. That’s what it was like for me, a light bulb.
Carrie Ann: Yeah, it really brought it together. And you’re right, it connected the dots for me. When we first started working together, I remember that you asked me if I had kids, because you said a lot of parents don’t even know they have ADHD until their children get to a certain age. Then they start to see it, and feel overwhelmed in their life. Why is it so difficult, not knowing that you have ADHD?
Jane Massengill: Yes, that was absolutely true for me. I mean, my diagnosis happened right in the middle of when my kids were really little. I was juggling a lot of stuff and trying to try to work. Again, it was just a big aha.
Carrie Ann: It was such a big aha for me too. And it really helped me understand a lot of things. As a child and for most of my life, I’ve always felt a bit different. Some parents will tell you, oh, no, you’re not special. But that’s not what I was trying to say. I was trying to say that I think my brain is a little different. But parents always try to keep you in line, and keep your feet on the floor. My mom was always doing that, she would go “oh, I don’t know about that”. There’s a lot of misconceptions out there about ADHD, especially adult ADHD. So first of all, what is ADHD?
Jane Massengill: Great question. ADHD is a genetically and biologically based syndrome. I like to think of it as a way of being in the world, but there is biology to it. There absolutely is clear science. There’s no disputing any of that. When you’re an adult with ADHD, you have issues with attention and focus, and doing things that are routine, that are boring. The opposite is true, though, too. Attention Deficit is such a misguided term, actually. We don’t have a deficit of attention. We have so much attention, we don’t know what to do with it! That’s the biggest challenge. So It’s all about learning how to bring that attention under control. That’s really the challenge.
Carrie Ann: I’m an open book, so I’ve been running around telling all my friends that I have ADHD. And I can see in some of their eyes that they don’t believe me, or they think that I’m just being a hypochondriac. Because when you have autoimmune conditions, you’re also often accused of being a hypochondriac. As I’ve done my research, working with you and Dr. Amen and reading every book possible about ADHD, I’ve realized that it’s just a different way of thinking. We can’t control the speed at which our brain wants to focus on things, so sometimes it hyper focuses and sometimes it wanders down the street. Is that a good way to describe it?
Jane Massengill: That’s a wonderful description. One of my favorite ADHD books, “ADHD 2.0: New Science and Essential Strategies for Thriving with Distraction” by Edward Hallowell and John Ratey, talks about this. Dr. Hallowell says that when you have ADHD, it’s like having a Ferrari brain with bicycle brakes. When you have ADHD, you prefrontal cortex, which is kind of like your supervisor or your secretary, is not functioning like it does for everybody else. So, you have issues with what they call “executive functioning”. I think of that as an executive secretary that’s just out to lunch. And sometimes that person comes back. And sometimes they don’t. You don’t always know when they’re going to come back. You can’t trust them to always be there for you. That is why learning how to manage it, working with a coach, and getting treatment for it will help – you’re training your manager.
Carrie Ann: I know it’s very important to manage your ADHD. You were telling me some statistics last time we did a session about unmanaged ADHD, can you share them?
Jane Massengill: Russell Barkley is a psychologist who’s been researching ADHD for 40 years now, and I had the honor of working with him when I worked at UMass Medical Center. He came up with research a couple of years ago, which absolutely blew my mind. This research says that if you are an undiagnosed, untreated, unmanaged adult with ADHD, your estimated life expectancy is up to 12 years shorter than everybody else’s. I mean, that’s a lot of time. And if you think about it, you’re more prone to accidents, car crashes, and not managing your health when you have untreated ADHD.
Carrie Ann: What about eating and stress? I think unmanaged ADHD had an effect on my autoimmune condition. This has been a hidden key to helping me feel better, because I noticed that my stress is escalates when my ADHD is unmanaged. And that’s why you have been such a blessing in my life, because you really taught me how to manage it.
Jane Massengill: It’s funny, when I when I share that statistic, everybody has a story. I just shared it with a colleague of mine yesterday, and she was telling me that when she was in her early 30s she found a spot on her hand. And her friend said look, you need to go get that spot on your hand checked. But it became one of those things that she just kept procrastinating on. When she finally saw the doctor, he said if she would have waited one more month, it would have killed her. It was melanoma. So I just think it’s there’s so many things. I think about my own family. My father was killed in a car accident when he was 48 years old. He was a policeman, and a lot of people with ADHD end up going towards those types of professions. But ADHD wasn’t around then. When I look back, it certainly makes me question if he was undiagnosed and died early because he was staying up really late, and probably not paying attention while he was driving. So ADHD is something worth paying attention to.
Carrie Ann: First of all, I’m so sorry about your loss. I didn’t know that. And it’s interesting when you do find out about your ADHD, you can kind of look back through your life and track how it may or may not have affected you.
I’ve also noticed that people often think of ADHD in a stereotypical way. They think ADHD only looks like a little boy in class who can’t sit still, who’s hitting the girls and having emotional outbursts. But look, that is not what I looked like growing up, and I’m sure that’s not what you looked like. You just mentioned that people with ADHD could be more accident prone. What are the other signs of somebody who has ADHD?
Jane Massengill: It looks different in everybody, and that’s why it’s hard to pin down for some people. People don’t necessarily understand it, there’s a lot of misconceptions. And some people – if you think of ADHD as an arc – barely meet the criteria for diagnosis. Other people have it on a much more extreme scale. It’s also an invisible disorder, so it’s harder to see sometimes. In adults, it can look like bouncing around. Many of my clients have these big balls that they sit on when we do coaching sessions, or they stand up. I always support that kind of stuff. Women are oftentimes missed with being diagnosed, especially as kids, because they’re the quiet ones that are sitting in the corner, not making any trouble. As adults, a lot of women with ADHD are afraid to engage because it feels too scary. They are more focused on wanting to do things that are less out in the world, and don’t push themselves to go out and do things.
Carrie Ann: I remember when I was younger, before I was diagnosed, someone said to me “oh, you have analysis paralysis”. And I sure do!
Jane Massengill: But you can also have hyper focus on things that you really love. A good friend of mine, Rick Carson, who wrote “Taming Your Gremlin”, told me once that I was like a pit bull on a rump roast. So when we are passionate about something we can dig in and not want to let go. When I first learned about ADHD, I read every single book that was out there, because I wanted to learn everything I possibly could about myself and about the people that I was working with. The benefit of that is we are really good at things that we love. The challenge of that is we sometimes don’t know when to stop, and we can burn ourselves out. And we don’t know when enough is enough. Almost everything with ADHD is a double edged sword.
Carrie Ann: One of the things that I’ve learned from working with you is that I need stand up against my brain. My brain wants to run away from a task that I know I need to do. I can walk by something on the floor 100 times, but that is not because I’m lazy, or that I don’t want to pick it up off the floor. Except that now I know that I have to actually put more effort into stopping and taking that moment to finish something. If it’s a short or mundane task, I can struggle with it. Even brushing my teeth in the morning. I do it every morning, but I’m always trying to talk myself out of it. I talk myself around it, like maybe I’ll do it this way. Maybe I’ll change the way I do it. It’s challenging. And I say all these things because I want people to understand that. You may not have ADHD, but you may struggle with some of the things that we’re talking about. And if you do have it, it doesn’t mean you’re limited in any way.
Did anything that Jane had to say surprise you? There’s so much to learn about ADHD, and a lot of what we know can lead to misconceptions! As Jane mentioned, the term “attention deficit” itself can be misleading – people with ADHD are also known to possess extreme focus. We hope that this conversation informed your own understanding of the disorder, or satisfied your curiosity. Factual information is the key to destigmatizing anything. Let us know your thoughts in the comments below, we’d love to hear what resonated with you.
Jane Massengill is a master certified coach and licensed social worker. She found coaching over 20 years ago when she was working with a group of psychiatrists who were exploring and expanding treatment for adults with Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder. A new profession in its infancy, coaching was exactly what Jane was looking for to bridge the gap between the internal personal growth work she was doing as a therapist and the external restructuring her clients needed with daily challenges such as getting to work on time, keeping a daily schedule or creating an exercise routine. She quickly fell into being among a small group of professionals in the country who had experience as a therapist with the training of a coach, plus years of work with adults with ADHD in a clinic setting. It put her in a unique position to write a chapter on ADD Coaching in Dr. Daniel Amen’s New York Times bestselling book, Healing ADD, and to participate in creating the first set of guidelines for ADD Coaches for the newly formed Adult Attention Deficit Disorder Association.
This article is an excerpt from Carrie Ann’s March 3rd, 2022 Instagram Live conversation with Jane Massengill. It has been edited for length and clarity.
Everyone can have issues with attention and focus – ADHD diagnosis or not. Our attention is constantly being pulled in every direction, and it’s never been harder to center ourselves and clear the clutter surrounding us. It’s no wonder that the wellness and self-help industries are at their largest, and that meditation has become part of mainstream culture. However, the saturation of the self-help market inevitably leads to confusion. Which tools are the best? How do I find what works for me? This is where coaches come in handy (check our are latest article on health coaches here – link Jim Curtis), because they know how to navigate the waters. If you’ve been feeling like it’s been difficult to focus, ADHD coach Jane Massengill has tried and true tools for you that you can implement right now.
Carrie Ann: What are some of the tools that can help ADHD? Because everybody says meditate, but what else is there? And why does meditation really help?
Jane Massengill: You don’t actually have to have a diagnosis of ADHD to benefit from the things that we’re talking about. Everybody can benefit from this, especially with the onset of the internet and so many distractions. Whether you have ADHD or not, our attention is constantly pulled, so it helps to know how to focus it. I think it’s no surprise that there’s been such a rise in meditation and mindfulness, because it absolutely helps us come to the present moment and quiet down some of the other things that are going on around us.
Meditation helps because it’s a practice of shifting your attention – taming your gremlin and quieting that monster of the mind. A book that I use all the time is “Taming Your Gremlin” by Rick Carson. Love it. For me personally, it really helped me understand that I can actually shift my attention. When I first got diagnosed with ADHD, I used to think my attention was like a fish on the bottom of a boat, just flopping around, and there was nothing I could do about it. I mean, that’s what it feels like oftentimes, right? But with meditation and with quieting the monster, you’re bringing your attention right back to your physical body, to your breath.
Carrie Ann: Oh, I see. I like to call it discipline. I’ve realized that if I’m not disciplined in the way my mind works, then it will go all over the place. Since working with you, I’ve realized that I need to be more disciplined without putting pressure on myself. Is that kind of what you’re saying, that with mediation we are learning how to build those muscles that support a better life with ADHD?
Jane Massengill: Absolutely. And then there are other tools. My clients will tell you that I’m a timer queen, I always have timers around me. I have a little timer in my office that I oftentimes set for 30 minutes if I’ve got something I want to keep my attention focused on. One of the things that happens with ADHD is what they call “time blindness”. I was actually talking to a client last night and he said, “my wife used to always say, if you loved me, you’d be on time”. And that makes me want to educate people all the more about what ADHD is all about, because it’s not about not caring about somebody and their time. It’s not being able to really understand what 10 minutes feels like, or what 15 minutes feels like. So I’m a major proponent of a watch that has a timer on it. Just this morning already used it half a dozen times, just to help me stay on track. So timers are a big one. Meditation is a big one.
Carrie Ann: What about lists? I’m a big list person.
Jane Massengill: Yeah, absolutely. Making lists, having something physical to help remind you, are what I think of as having homes for things in your mind. If you’ve got 15 things you’re thinking of all at the same time, making a list helps you do a brain dump. Any kind of tool that help you get a sense of time, like a big wall calendar, will help. I always have a poster sized calendar for the whole year, because it lets you stand back and see an entire 12 months at a time.
Carrie Ann: Yes, especially with autoimmune conditions, if you have a bird’s eye view of what the month looks like, you can schedule in time to rest. And you can you can make better decisions, because personally, I have a tendency to overbook myself. I get super excited about things, but then I can’t do them because I’ve said yes to seven things at the same time.
Now, one of the things that you taught me that I thought was so fascinating was the VARK test. You said that this can help anybody, whether you have ADHD or not. It teaches us about our learning style, which I thought was really interesting. How does that help somebody with ADHD or somebody who doesn’t have ADHD?
Jane Massengill: Well, we’re constantly learning and it helps to know what our style of learning is. And so whether you have ADHD or not, I recommend this test, especially for parents and their kids. VARK stands for visual, aural, read / write, and kinesthetic. It helps you communicate with not only other people around you, but understand how you communicate with yourself as well. And you, Carrie Ann, are actually are four-part learner. For example, one of yours is writing things down. So anybody that is working with you on your team needs to know that.
I’m also working with a college student right now who is a four-part learner. He really struggled with trying to get a project done, until he started realizing, okay, I need to make a diagram about this, I need to talk with somebody about it, I need to have a live example of somebody actually doing this, and I need to take notes. Then he can get it. But without knowing that, you struggle and you start beating yourself up. So I think the VARK test is a brilliant contribution that is super affordable, and can help anybody.
Carrie Ann: As somebody who’s also a four-part learner, that just means that in order for me to learn something, I kind of need to do it four different ways for it to sink in. And that did frustrate me because I was like, why am I such a slow learner, yet I’m also so fast? I pick up things so quickly, all the nuances in a room, and I can just feel it all. That’s what makes me good on live television. I feel like it’s my superpower. I’m aware of everything all at once, and I can respond to it or not. And the VARK test has helped me to know that it’s going to take me a few more steps. I actually learned patience with myself, which is something that you have really helped me with.
Jane Massengill: Yeah, not beat yourself up. Because that monster in your mind is always going to be right there at the edge to take you down.
Carrie Ann: I know there’s people who just think ADHD is BS, right? So what do you say to people like that? How do you help them to understand, or do they even need to understand?
Jane Massengill: Well, I do always want to reiterate that ADHD is not a belief, it’s not like a religion. It is a brain based set of issues set of challenges. Which by the way, it can really be improved. In fact, last week I saw a brain scan that was 20 years old. And we compared it to a new scan, and it was so hopeful to see the neuroplasticity of the brain, and how you can really improve your prefrontal cortex. So it is real. I think the most important thing to understand is that it’s invisible, and everybody has certain traits or characteristics that can look like ADHD. But if you have ADHD, you’re going to have more of a lifelong challenge with attention, distractibility, and focus. So it’s important for people to just have empathy, and educate yourself or stay open.
Carrie Ann: Stay open. That’s one of the things that I was surprised about in my work with you. Because it does require a certain level of discipline to get your ADHD in a manageable form for your life. And I’ve noticed that you have so much compassion when you help me, and that we often get into much deeper issues about things that I’m afraid of. When I tell you I’m struggling with something, what I love is that you don’t just go, oh, that’s just ADHD. You’re always like, well, what are you afraid of? What’s happening there? What are the possible outcomes? And I find that to be so nurturing. And so very healing. So if somebody were to go and seek out the help of a coach in their lifetime, what would the what advice would you give them in what to look for?
Jane Massengill: I think it’s really important to make sure that you connect with somebody. I always tell people it’s helpful to interview two or three coaches and make sure there’s a bond. So interview some people, and make sure that you are working with somebody that has some background and knowledge on what ADHD is all about.
Carrie Ann: You have been coaching for a long time, so I’m very curious to know if there is an area of life that people struggle with the most?
Jane Massengill: Absolutely – self-confidence. It’s probably top of the heap. If you’ve been told your entire life that you’re a square peg in a round hole, and you don’t fit in, you’re going to start to question yourself. And not give yourself credit when you do achieve great things. So I think the process of coaching is about helping you find your unique shape, you know, to get out of that square peg in a round hole mentality. There’s also healing to be done from some of the scars of the past. So that’s always a big thing.
Organization of time and space is always a big thing, and just struggling with getting the mundane things done on a regular basis. In fact, one of the things I started a couple of years ago is a three hour time management workshop. It’s called the Get Er’ Done Workshop and we do it on Zoom. Everybody starts with this list of things to do that’s very typical, like getting the dishes done, making phone calls, etc. It’s an accountability group, but I’m coaching people the whole time. So everyone shares who they are, what they’re working on, and what they’ll be doing for the first hour. We set a timer, and then everybody turns their camera off. I stay behind the screens. And you go and do your work, then come back at the top of every hour for 10 minutes to check in with me. I always have people listen for their distractions and ask what got in the way. So there’s coaching, but it’s also about just knowing that you’re not alone, and that there are other people that are very successful in life and struggle with some of the same challenges.
Carrie Ann: I love that you’re building a community for people. And, you know, it’s funny, as I listen to this conversation, I can feel even more that I’m not separate. I can also tell that some people are going to read this and be like, what are you talking about? But you know what, for people who have it, that workshop just sounds so enticing. I often feel better when there’s somebody around and it’s easier to get my projects done. I know that there are people out there that this is also resonating with, so how do they sign up for the Get ‘Er Done workshop?
Jane Massengill: Yes, they can go to my website, janemassengill.com. And they can use code conversations (lowercase or uppercase) for 60% off the price!
Carrie Ann: I love it. You’re so good at what you do, and I am grateful that you have come into my life and that I have you as a resource. And I think in this world, we’re all kind of struggling – these are difficult times. So knowing that there’s people that you can reach out to and get help from is amazing. I just have one final thought. I want to know where your compassion comes from, because you just have so much of it!
Jane Massengill: Thank you. I grew up in a community in Canton, Ohio, and my dad was a policeman and my mom was a nurse. All my all my relatives were teachers or in some kind of service industry. And I knew at a very early age that I wanted to be a social worker. After my father died, I had a couple of teachers that really took me under their wing. I think they were really pivotal for me in terms of helping me connect with that thing that’s inside of me that wants to do something important in the world for other people. So I just feel incredibly blessed that I’ve been able to clear out some of the clutter from my ADHD so I can connect with and help other people.
Carrie Ann: I love it. You’re following your dreams, and you help everybody that you work with follow their dreams. You’re helping me fulfill that right now with Carrie Ann Conversations.
Already planning a trip to the app store to browse meditation apps? If you’re interested, we have an article here on Carrie Ann’s favorite meditations on the app Insight Timer. In fact, Lisa Romano, a life coach we recently interviewed, has her own guided meditations on the app.
We hope this conversation gave you something new to think about. If something resonated with you, let us know in comments below! We would love to hear from you.
Madisyn Taylor is the cofounder and former editor-in-chief of DailyOM. She is the author of Unmedicated. The Four Pillars of Natural Wellness (January 2018) and an award-winning and bestselling author of two previous books including DailyOM: Inspirational Thoughts for a Happy, Healthy, and Fulfilling Day (#1 Amazon self-help, #3 Amazon overall) and DailyOM: Learning to Live (#1 Amazon self-help, #7 Amazon overall). Her books have been translated into more than fifteen languages. Madisyn has also been a contributing author for Oprah.com. This article is an excerpt from Carrie Ann’s January 20th, 2022 Instagram Live conversation with Madisyn Taylor. It has been edited for length and clarity.
How many times have you tried the latest wellness trend only to not achieve the results you were hoping for? Maybe you gave meditation a shot, and it just wasn’t for you. Maybe your friend told you about the latest self help book that changed their life, but reading isn’t the way you learn best. If there’s one thing we’ve learned here at Carrie Ann Conversations, it’s that there are many approaches to wellness and it’s perfectly normal to go through trial and error! That’s something that our guest, Madisyn Taylor, preaches as well. Madisyn has gone through trauma and come out on the other side determined to help people begin their journey to achieve ultimate wellness. Her tools are vast and she uses her own experiences to inspire others to make changes in their lives. We loved having her on Carrie Ann Conversations: Journey to Wellness, and can’t wait for you to hear what she has to say!
Carrie Ann: Welcome to a another Carrie Ann Conversations Journey to Wellness. Today, I want to talk about healing. Whether that be from past trauma, confronting your fears, or just resetting your minds to stop self-sabotaging. I don’t know if you guys do that, but I know I’m certainly guilty of it. Joining us today in this conversation is a best-selling author, meditation specialist, and my new friend, Madisyn Taylor. She’s also the Co-Founder of DailyOM, and author of the book of the same name.
Madisyn, thank you for joining me. I have been reading the DailyOM for years. It’s basically my nightstand and bathroom reading all the time. It’s one of those books that I just always turn back to whenever I’m lost. And you have helped me so much in my struggles, before I even knew that I had a journey to go on. Would you mind telling my viewers about the DailyOM?
Madisyn Taylor: Yes, we started it way back in 2004, which seems like forever ago. The purpose of it really was to help people get on their own journeys and have their own lightbulb moments. We did that by having me write sort of, I guess a daily essay if you will, that comes to your inbox every morning. The idea was that people would all be thinking these good thoughts at the same time while they’re having their coffee in the morning. The essays really were about my own life journey, but I didn’t write it in a first person perspective because I didn’t want it to be about me. I wanted everyone to be able to relate to it. It was everything from relationships, to depression, anxiety, to trauma – just things that we all go through every day. And that we need help with because I don’t know about you, but I didn’t get an instruction manual when I was born. I didn’t know how to navigate any of the stuff that was happening to me. So I thought that I could finally put all of my years of experience, all of my loss, all of my trauma, and all of my learning into helping other people. Back in 2004 the internet really wasn’t that popular yet, so we took the email perspective of that. And then the business model of it was to sell online courses in that same genre. Now it’s anything from yoga, to relationships, and everything in between.
Carrie Ann: It’s really quite an amazing destination. It has everything.
Madisyn Taylor: Yes, there’s something for everybody. But what was important to me was to have it affordable to everybody. So you can take a course for $15, which I think is phenomenal. And these are six week courses to one year courses. It’s not a one day or a few hour thing. I know in my own healing journey, I could not afford all of the healing that I needed. Acupuncturists, psychiatrists, and all these specialists are a minimum of $100 each session and if you don’t have insurance, you’re kind of screwed. I really, really, wanted to have healing available to everybody. So my daily essays were free, and that was my service work to humanity. Then the business model was the courses, but at an affordable rate.
Carrie Ann: It’s attainable for everyone, and that’s why I love it so much. Part of Carrie Ann Conversations Journey to Wellness is all about spreading accessibility to wellness. Hopefully people can find just a tidbit here and there, something that resonates with them, even if they don’t know it’s resonating. Something that sounds interesting to them, so that they can maybe do their own research and head out into their own discovery. Because as we both know, it’s a journey.
Now, let’s move on. I’ve heard you talking about fear, and I think that plays such a huge factor in this conversation about healing from trauma. So what are the most common fears that you think we all share? Because this is about building community, finding places where we are similar, right? How can we turn the fear switch off or down?
Madisyn Taylor: It’s kind of funny, the two most common fears that everybody has are getting what you want and losing what you have. Imagine, oh, I got a million dollars, I really wanted that. And then oh my god, the taxman wants some, my best friend wants something. Now you’re in fear of having it all go away.
Carrie Ann: Say it again, one more time, because that’s powerful. What are the two fears that you think everybody has?
Madisyn Taylor: Getting what you want, and then losing what you have. Getting it and then losing it. Those are the fears that that humans have. But really, the fear that people have is doing the deep dive. You and I know that in order to heal, you have to do the deep dive, you have to peel the layers. I’m a big baby steps person, and I don’t believe in going to the center nugget right away. You’ve got to peel the outer layers. It really is like an onion. Every baby step serves a purpose. And if you dive in too deep, too fast, you’re going to get scared and you’re never going to go back. So my work is about gentle baby steps.
My big tip is to make a list of your fears, and then go right into all of them and write as much as you can about each fear. What is the fear? How does it make you feel? How is it affecting your life? Because it is and you may not know it. And then what I like to do – I’m giving homework and I love to give homework-
Carrie Ann: I love you for giving homework, you’re my kind of girl!
Madisyn Taylor: Thank you! Once you write down your fear and how it makes you feel – and writing about it may make you feel nervous – write a counter thought to that fear. That’s how you’re going to start healing the fear. Let’s take something really simple, like I’m afraid of flying. It makes me shake like a leaf. I think about it for three days beforehand, I start stressing, I get nervous. I’m worried I’m going to miss my flight, that I’m going to sit next to someone that’s going to smell bad, that we’re going to crash, I hate turbulence, all of this stuff. So I write it all down, and I feel the anxiety coming up.
Then I think, what can I do about that? Well, I can tell the flight attendant I’m nervous, and she or he will pay a lot more attention to you. I can talk to my neighbor sitting next to me and say I’m feeling a little nervous. I do that every single flight, and they turn out to be like a therapist for me. I can bring comfort items on the plane, right? That’s kind of an example that’s not super personal in terms of fears. It’s personal to me, but it’s not a deep seated fear. So name it and claim it, and then write a solution to it or a counter statement to your fear. You will look at it all in your journal as one unit and say, wow, you know what, that’s not as bad as I thought it was.
Carrie Ann: Oh my God, that’s wonderful. Name it, claim it, gather it into a manageable amount, look at it, and realize it’s not as big as you’re making it. I think when you write it down, it really does help you. I find that things, when they’re still in your mind, they become huge, right? We have to remember as human beings that we are so powerful with what we can do with one little idea. We can turn it into something amazing. That’s the power of creation. However, the power of creation can also create a huge monster that’s chasing us at every turn. We can run faster, or we can put it in perspective, which is what you just did. That’s a great tip.
In your own journey through trauma to wellness you’ve spent a lot of time defining things and putting things into words for people. How would you define wellness now, here in 2022, after all that you’ve been through?
Madisyn Taylor: I think that wellness is not a one size fits all scenario. It’s going to look a little different for all of us, our packaging is different. But what’s really important is that it can’t be segmented. Wellness needs to be body, mind, and spirit, the trifecta. They really need to go together. You can’t have full wellness without having wellness in all of those areas. And it’s all attainable. I know it can sound a little overwhelming, but again, if you take your baby steps it’s definitely attainable. Once you fix one of them, you’ll find that the others tend to fall into place. I mean, you are this amazing temple, this healing machine. And you always hear those terms when you’re a little kid, like the hip bone is connected to the backbone. We are all connected.
Those three things intertwine and work together to make a healthy human being. It’s really important, but most people ignore one of those. We always really go for the physical health, but the mind and the spiritual health are equally as important. Spiritual health is really about journaling and meditation, maybe having an altar and those sorts of practices. It’s not about religion or going to church, although that could be it for some people. Then the mind is brain health, which of course you talked about with that brilliant doctor last week.
Carrie Ann: Yes, Dr. Amen. That was a great conversation. You know, these conversations, they’re mostly for me. Because I just love talking about wellness, and I love hearing about other people’s journeys. I love hearing other people’s perspective, because as you say, the journey is unique and individual to each one of us. It took me looking at 1000 trillion different things to figure out what’s working. And look, in three months, different things are going to work. It’s constantly a work in progress. Wellness is not a one and done kind of thing. Madisyn has got like 8,000 different ways to approach wellness. And that’s because she’s been studying it for so long, because she needed to for her own journey in life. That’s what my wish is for all of you – that you can find wellness. The way to do it is to keep experimenting and working on it. It’s something that takes work just like building your home, or building your family and raising your children. It’s the same thing. You are an entity that is worthy of all the love, caring, and all the wellness that could possibly come your way.
Experimenting, working, and building. That’s what healing and the road to wellness entails, but it’s so rewarding when you start to see a shift in your life. Especially when you begin to fit all of the pieces together, as Madisyn said. The mind, body, and spirit are interconnected and of equal importance. Don’t be afraid to take baby steps and work through one area at a time – the puzzle pieces will fall into place at the right time. If you’re interested in hearing more about Madisyn’s story and watching the full interview, you can view it here!
You can find Madisyn Taylor’s books, social media, online courses, and other resources at these links:
Instagram: @mtmadisyntaylorMadisyn’s websiteAmazon bookstoreDailyOm
John Amaral is an energy practitioner, author, educator and founder of the Energy Flow Formula, a somatic energy healing practice. Originally trained as a chiropractor, John developed the Formula over 25 years of working with thousands of people from more than 50 countries. His clients include A-list celebrities, entrepreneurs, athletes, influencers and thought-leaders. John uses the unique principles of the Energy Flow Formula to help his clients heal physical injuries, reduce stress, anxiety, and depression, and reach and sustain new levels of energy, clarity, and fulfillment so they can feel and live better. Most recently, John appeared in the Goop Labs Netflix series with Gwyneth Paltrow. He has also been featured a number of podcasts, including Bulletproof Radio with Dave Asprey, founder of Bulletproof.
This article is an excerpt from Carrie Ann’s March 24th, 2022 Instagram Live conversation with Dr. John Amaral. It has been edited for length and clarity.
Have you ever wondered about the “aura” or energy you unconsciously put out into the world? We’ve all said “oh, I like his/her energy” at some point, whether or not we actually understood why we felt this way. It’s just a feeling we get, or an instinct. If you’ve ever wanted to dive deeper into that feeling and explore your own personal energy, Dr. John Amaral is the guest for you! He calls our “vibes” or “auras” the “energy body” that radiates off of our beings. And there’s a lot more to that energy body than you’d think! Read on to hear about what your energy blueprint is and how you can tap into it.
Carrie Ann: I know you talk about an energy blueprint. What is that? How does that work?
Dr. John Amaral: What I call the energy blueprint is the hard wiring you came into this world with. Everybody has kind of a unique style and way of experiencing and processing life. The blueprint has to do with different frequencies, bandwidths, or layers. You might call it the energy body. There is a field of energy around the physical body that radiates out, and it can be many feet off the body. You can measure the electromagnetic field with instruments three to five feet or so off the body.
Carrie Ann: Is it like an aura?
Dr. John Amaral: Aura is another name for it. Some people call it subtle body or the subtle energy body. And people call it the koshas in vedic tradition, like yoga. There are all different names, and different cultures have different names for it. It’s a real thing. It’s kind of a non-thing thing.
Carrie Ann: Even though we can’t see it, it’s real.
Dr. John Amaral: Some people can see it. We have our five senses, and some people can read or see auras, right? So our five senses pick up this subtle energy that is sort of invisible. It’s like another dimension. You can’t see radio waves, you can’t see x-rays, you can’t see infrared.
Carrie Ann: But they’re there, and they’re working!
Dr. John Amaral: And they will affect you. If you are exposed to radiation, it will cause damage. If you tune your antenna into radio frequencies, they’re there. You just set your antenna and you pick up those different frequencies. So, their energies exist, we’re just seeing a tiny bandwidth. We can only see a very, very small bandwidth of the visual field. Everything from gamma radiation, which are really tiny waves, all the way out to radio waves, which span mountains, are there. That’s part of what the energy body is – frequencies of energy that most people don’t see, but some do. For some people it’s more of a feeling, or it’s kinesthetic. Some people hear sounds and tones, but we all have various ways of tuning into this energy around us. There’s actually research on the sense of being stared at. People from around the world have an ability to sense if somebody’s staring at them.
Carrie Ann: For sure! You can feel it.
Dr. John Amaral: And this is non-local, it could be somewhere else in the world. There’s also more research on dogs knowing when their owners are coming home, even if they’re 50 miles away. When they leave the office, the dogs get off the couch. Rupert Shelldrake wrote a book about this. So there’s some nonphysical, energetic, invisible field that we’re tuned into. And this is really where things are going in the 21st century. There’s a lot of movement into what Nikola Tesla called the age of energy. We have devices now, MRIs, which measure fluctuations in energy, that give us a picture. So, we’re using tools to measure energy, and we’re going to be using more and more techniques and approaches that work with energy in a more conscious way. And the blueprint is my approach to that subtle energy body, and my way of working with that and helping people learn how to work with it themselves. Once you understand your blueprint, there are certain practices that will help you. There are certain things that may not be positive for you to be doing. Once you understand what that blueprint is, you can begin to do self-care. For example, can we talk about your blueprint.
Carrie Ann: Yes! So what is my blueprint?
Dr. John Amaral: So for you, there are these different aspects or layers of your energy body, and I’ll just kind of quickly run through them. There’s what’s called the etheric body or life force. It’s very close to the physical body. It’s like that layer of energy you feel when you just very lightly touch somebody. Maybe you’re about to hold someone’s hand, right?
Carrie Ann: (Laughing) That’s like my favorite kind of touch actually!
Dr. John Amaral: Yeah there’s a little vibration or heat. And that vital energy is not only in the physical body, but it’s also in all life – so plants and animals. That’s why sometimes when someone is feeling low energy they just hug their animal. They cuddle their dog and it’s like, yes, I feel better. That’s the life force energy. Then there’s emotional energy. Then there’s mental energy. Then there’s the energy that I call relational, that ties into your heart. The ability to receive and give in a relationship. Then you have what I would call the higher mind, which is tied into your ability to create meaning and optimize your life. And then there is what I would call your soul, the part that transcends the thinking mind. That is your connection to the infinite universe all around you. As you go out further from the physical body, it is an experience of expansion into those higher dimensions of your energy field.
So for you, you’re really connected. Everyone who knows you or has been around you knows that you have a radiance and a vibration. You bring a lot of joy and light, and you’re very connected. When I go off 4, 5, 6 feet from your body, you open up, there’s freedom, there’s flow. I would say you’re very resourced in that part of your energy blueprint. Your sense of yourself and the universe become blended into one. You also are very connected to your emotional. Sometimes we get energized by that energy within ourselves. And sometimes it takes other things outside of ourselves, or other people, to bring about that awareness. For you, when you’re around others, it lights up your emotions. With the way you’re wired, it would be more challenging to feel your own emotions by yourself, without some reference from others. I’m not saying you don’t feel deeply, but the expression of and ability to connect into the emotional body pulls you into relationships in a way that also helps you give your gifts. Even when I was working with you on the table, you said you were feeling this golden light.
Carrie Ann: I always feel golden light.
Dr. John Amaral: So you’re very golden, and that’s part of the energy blueprint. It’s your connection into that infinite field.
Carrie Ann: And that’s what this series is all about, is trying to spread the joy and spread awareness. But you talked about my emotional body pulling me into relationships with others, and that can lead to codependency. It can also lead to an anxious attachment style. I attach to people very quickly, and it’s really hard for me to detach from people. Do you think that could be part of the reason why?
Dr. John Amaral: Yeah, I think our attachment styles and how we were wired in our early years of life absolutely influences what parts of our blueprint get activated. I see the blueprint as something that’s there. It’s like you come into this world with it, and then how you activate it or what parts you’re not using as effectively is something that can be learned. If you had anxious attachment and you learned to get into these more codependent relationships, then by connecting to the emotional part of your energy body you can learn how to be in relationships with others without attaching in a dysfunctional way. You can start to take responsibility for your patterns, but allow the expression of that energy. And then learn how to feel your own emotions without necessarily that grasping or attachment. So there’s ways to work with this blueprint that kind of free you up from the attachment. It frees you up from the conditioning, and there’s an art and a science to it. Currently, I have a questionnaire around this and eventually we will make it so people can check to see what their personal blueprint is.
Carrie Ann: That’s very exciting, because I think that’s going to help a lot of people. You just talked about the relationships and how my previous style was a very codependent style, but I have been working on myself for the past 8 months. So, I want to know if you noticed a shift in the way my energy flowed? And if you notice a difference from the last time we worked together to now?
Dr. John Amaral: Yeah, I absolutely do. There’s a part of the blueprint that’s the life force energy, or you could call it the etheric body, and it’s that sense of life force. And that energy and that consciousness is tied into survival, certainty, and needing to keep it all together. And if we feel challenged and we don’t feel like we have enough flow of life force, we tend to tighten up because we’re trying to just stay safe.
Carrie Ann: Fight or flight.
Dr. John Amaral: Yes, fight or flight, and freeze mode. We freeze it all up, because I don’t feel like I have enough energy to make it through. If I freeze it all up, I’ll be safe. I’ll somehow be able to get through this. What I noticed working with you today is that there was more flow of life force. In your energy blueprint, the life force was activated in a healthy way. Which means you go from holding it all together to like, I’m here, I’m in this body. I’m grounded, I’m present, I’m alive and I’m safe in the world.
When I started working with you, it was immediately flowing. That told me that whatever work you’ve been doing in the time since we’ve worked together shifted you. You’ve shifted from that vigilant, protective, survival mode to more safety and more presence with your body. That was one of the challenges that has been going on for you, and for a lot of people. With the way you’re wired, it’s easy for you to connect to the place where you and the universe emerge. You can connect to that more easily than some people, but the challenge for you was staying connected to that while also coming into your body and being here in this physical body. That’s where I see a huge shift. You were both connected in that way and grounded in your body, which means you get to have that expanded state. You get to feel open, free, and awake at the same time, and still be here doing what you’re made to do.
Carrie Ann: I want to talk about the healing really quickly. During the healing, I move a lot. Some people have seen your viral healing videos with others moving around a lot and been like, is that an exorcism? There’s naysayers. And I’m just curious, what do you say to that? It’s not an exorcism, and I can speak to that. But I move, and some of it I’m doing because I feel good. Some of it is intentional because I’m letting things out. Some of it is not intentional.
Dr. John Amaral: This comes back to that conditioning. When is it appropriate to move your body in these ways? In the sessions, that’s an appropriate environment and a really safe place for you to just let it go. So when you’re working with the energy field, each layer of the blueprint has a different effect in the physical. Just like if you hold a magnet over a bunch of pieces of metal, it’ll move the metal. That magnetic field will influence the physical. The same thing happens in our bodies. Our sensory systems are picking up information and the body is going to move and respond. If you are driving in your car and you look in the rearview mirror and see flashing lights, you might have tension, stress, or stop breathing. And then they go by and you feel the big release, nothing touched you. It was just light. Nothing touched your body, but your body responded and went into tension.
The same thing can happen when something positive happens. You feel or sense someone’s energy feel that inspires you, or you feel your own connection to a higher sense of yourself. And all of a sudden your body opens up. Typically, when you relax, you go into extension. Your neck goes back, your heart lifts up, your arms open up. So when I’m working with people, I’m working on those different levels of the energy field and I’m looking for the physiology and the anatomy that shift. Part of it is unconscious, and the work influences your body directly. Your body will just respond without you doing anything. Part of it is interactive, where you’re like, oh, this feels good. I’m going to do that more.
Carrie Ann: Right. You and your energy creates a very safe space to allow the person on the table to release, and be free and completely authentic. Which we are not always able to be in life. And I think that’s a beautiful gift. You’ve talked about energy spots. What are those so that people can understand how you start to work?
Dr. John Amaral: When you have stress, an injury, a trauma, a loss, or an accident, whether that be physical, emotional, or psychological, they all create a similar kind of reaction in different ways. The body goes into fight or flight, it goes into protective mode. When that happens, you’re tightening everything up. Your breath gets more shallow. Your nervous system goes under tension, the tissues of your body tighten up. There’s a holding of energy, and when that energy starts flowing and releasing, there’s a discharge of that tension. And that’s where that movement can come from. The muscles and tendons are releasing, so someone might start vibrating just like animals will shake after they experience a stressful situation. And when I’m working with someone on the table, or I’m teaching someone how to work with this themselves, we want to identify the places where you can have access to your energy. The places that are most open and most free-flowing already. Which is interesting because most people think, well, it’s hurting here, it’s tight here.
Carrie Ann: So it’s not like acupuncture where you go to the pain and tight part.
Dr. John Amaral: Yeah, and interestingly, when they work with those points in the meridian system, acupuncturists don’t always go to that place of pain first. They want to open up the flow of energy so that it helps the whole system begin to relax.
Carrie Ann: So you go to the most open spot.
Dr. John Amaral: Yes, I go to the most open. It’s showing somebody, hey, you know that this is working really well? And they’re like, oh wow, hey, you know, I didn’t think of that. And it’s like, you know, you’re pretty amazing. And they’re like, I think I am! All of a sudden they start feeling more resourced. If we show your brain how to associate with a place in your body that is actually already flowing, it starts that circuit building. It starts building that pattern and then you go, oh wow. I can actually breathe more easily here. Now I can start to unwind this and now we will actually guide you into starting to change things. I call it generative, meaning you you’re putting a focus on something that’s working and you’re enhancing.
Carrie Ann: Oh, I like that. Like positive reinforcement.
Dr. John Amaral: Yes. We go, where is the energy already flowing positively and let’s get that flowing even more. That will spill over and start drawing along the areas that are bound up. Technically, that’s called entrainment in physics. You take something that’s already flowing and you help it spread. Then it touches the places that are bound up and pretty soon you’re like, oh, I feel more free. Instead of saying, this is wrong and that is wrong. I think it’s also important not to just go, I only want to focus on what’s great and not focus on what’s not working. Because that can be a bypass, that can be denial. To go to those places that are more challenged, to go to those places where there’s a relationship challenge, or a physical challenge, or something that’s harder to be with, let’s first start with where we can connect. From there, let’s start to take a journey into these other places. That’s always how I work. I see these spots you’re asking about as access points or portals. Like little wormholes into the energy system.
Carrie Ann: I can feel it. One of the concepts you’ve also taught me about is grounding, and going outside and putting my feet in the earth. Why is that important?
Dr. John Amaral: It’s important for a number of reasons. That sense of being ground and connected to your body and at the same time being expanded and connected to the universe all around you is an integrated approach. Some people have more of a challenge feeling their connection to something great or something transcendent. Some people have an easy time connecting to that transcendent, but more of challenge in grounding and connecting to their body. It’s important because the grounding also connects you into a life force energy, which is that first layer of your blueprint. That life force energy is what is involved in all the functions of your body, beneath the radar. For example, you don’t have to think about your heart beating, your immune system working, your cell repair and regeneration, your digestion. All of that is connected to the life force energy. Grounding and feeling present with your body right here in this time and space is what helps you stay in the present, helps you stay vital, and helps you stay in flow in the physical. Versus just sort of leaving your body to go into these higher states that don’t have a connection to this time and space.
Carrie Ann: I have learned that it really is a lot of work to achieve wellness. There are so many layers to healing and this inner and outer world or spirit. It takes intention. And I think what you’ve given the world through your gift is a very clear – even though it doesn’t seem so at first – understanding of how it all comes together. And I just want to thank you because you’re amazing. And your work with me has helped me tremendously.
What do you think about the energy blueprint? Are you curious to find out what yours is? Would you work with an energy healer? Let us know in the comments below! We would love to hear from you!
As Carrie Ann said, there are so many layers to healing. Body and energy work is just one layer that is available for you to try. Carrie Ann Conversations is all about providing you with access to information so that you can make your own informed decision for your health. It takes work to sift through the abundance of options out there, but it’s worth it to find what really works for you.
For more information on Dr. John Amaral and his Energy Flow Formula, follow the links below:
With over twenty-five years of dancing experience and several championship titles under her belt, Emmy nominated professional dancer Cheryl Burke tangoed and sambaed her way into the hearts of millions through the hit ABC television show, “Dancing with the Stars”, becoming champion twice: with Emmitt Smith in season three and Drew Lachey in season two. In addition, she has starred in NBC’s “I Can Do That” in 2016 and became a coach on Lifetime’s “Dance Moms” in 2017. In 2020, Cheryl teamed with Backstreet Boys superstar and former DWTS partner AJ McLean to host the iHeart Radio produced podcast, “Pretty Messed Up”. This past year Cheryl also delved into the fashion world with her loungewear collection with clothing brand Bailey Blue.
This article is an excerpt from Carrie Ann’s March 10th, 2022 Instagram Live conversation with Cheryl Burke. It has been edited for length and clarity.
How many times have you seen a pseudo “wellness tips” Instagram post that implies that all it takes to achieve self-actualization is to drink more water and do some stretches? One of the major themes of the Carrie Ann Conversations: Journey to Wellness series is that healing and achieving wellness takes work. It requires trial and error, and an ongoing commitment to do things that feed into every aspect of our wellbeing – mind, body, and spirit. Cheryl Burke is someone who exemplifies this commitment and doesn’t shy away from sharing her own struggles. She’s an open book, and her conversation with Carrie Ann shed a refreshing light on just what it takes to come to a place of true wellness. We hope you enjoy!
Carrie Ann: So, this show is about wellness, as you know, and giving people the tools to help with their own wellness journey. I know you’ve been very open about your healing process and your whole wellness routine. When did healing become a focus for you?
Cheryl Burke: I would say when my father passed away. That was right when I was engaged, in 2019. And I’ve always been very fascinated with the brain, our intelligence, and how that all works. I’ve been listening to lots of podcasts lately, like, honestly, I don’t even listen to music anymore. I’m really into these yogis, even though I’m not a yogi. I’m not even close. But I love the spiritual world. I was born Catholic, and even though I’m not necessarily religious now, I do believe in in higher power. I think with my sobriety, it forced me to have to believe in that. As I started surrendering to that, then I really started diving in deep.
Carrie Ann: When you say that, you mean like a higher power?
Cheryl Burke: A higher power, God, whatever you want to call it. It’s hard for me to say God, but I know that there is a higher power, higher presence, universe, angels, whatever you want to say.
Carrie Ann: Yeah, I think that’s the beauty of this higher power. I was raised Christian, and so I speak to God all the time. But I’m a little bit more aligned with maybe more Buddhist philosophies.
Cheryl Burke: Yes, same.
Carrie Ann: Or Shintoism, like I believe that everything has a spirit. That’s probably from my Hawaiian background, because we have a very large Japanese population there. I think you and I are both melting pots. What are your nationalities again?
Cheryl Burke: I did 23 and Me less than a year ago, and I didn’t realize that I’m 53% Ashkenazi Jewish. And the rest is Filipina. My dad thought he was Irish and Russian, but he clearly didn’t have any clue.
Carrie Ann: You and I bonded on the fact that we both that we were Asian and Irish. (Laughing) We were like, and we can drink!
Cheryl Burke: (Laughing)Yes! I was proud. I was like, we don’t get red!
Carrie Ann: We can handle it! Cut to now, where I don’t drink. I wouldn’t say I’m completely sober, that I don’t drink at all. I’ll drink on a very, very special occasion. I’ve learned that as you get older, it just wears and tears on your body and it’s not worth it. But you’re sober. How did that happen? I’ve been fascinated with this.
Cheryl Burke: It happened right after my father passed away. So a lot of big life moments. But it was honestly for a vanity reason. I’ve said this before, but it was like as if my subconscious was rejecting poison. I used to be a proud, I would say, functioning alcoholic. Not like I was wasted, but nothing would affect me. I thought the alcohol was what would help me out of my social anxiety. It got me more comfortable. The only time I never had to drink was before I danced. But then I realized the after effects, right? So the after effects of being hungover, or starting to feel really insecure. And I truly believe that alcohol does that to your brain – it really made my thoughts louder and louder. It made me start questioning and made me feel insecure. I’ll never forget Chad Ochocinco’s season. We did a foxtrot, and my thoughts were so loud, saying “you’re going to forget your own choreography”. And I forgot my choreography! I swayed the wrong way and it threw him off completely. And after that moment, I just ended up drinking more to quiet my thoughts.
Then, right before Matt and I got married, I basically broke out into hives. So I tried everything (to keep drinking), believe me. I was like, let me take a shot of fireball. Let me try vodka. Let me try wine. All in one sitting, full out. And my whole face turned red. So I was like, I cannot do that. When I make a decision, I make a decision. And then I quit cold turkey. And I’m not saying that it is right or wrong, and that this is the way for everybody. Because most of the time it’s not, a lot of people go to rehab. It’s one step at a time.
Carrie Ann: Can I ask, do you go to meetings?
Cheryl Burke: Yes. I haven’t lately, so I’m not going to say that I’m religious about it. But I do have a sponsor that I check in with every week, as well as two therapists, and an online course. You know, I’m very excessive. I’m an addict, I will always be an addict. And that is something that I have to work on daily. It’s a daily practice for me.
Carrie Ann: Changing the direction of your focus towards wellness, which is what I’ve also done, makes your life so much better. Then there’s this whole new world! And what I have realized is it actually takes a lot of effort to really find true wellness.
You just mentioned that you have a really big team, right? And I think that’s what I’ve learned through this process – it definitely takes a team. Even if you can’t afford to get a psychotherapist, there’s apps that you can use and so many tangible, accessible ways to get help. Also reaching out to friends, like having one friend that you confess these things to that understands or is further on the journey. So, what kind of team do you have?
Cheryl Burke: Okay, let me go back to what you were saying. So, absolutely, I hear you. And I think the wellness doesn’t ever stop, because I am always a work in progress. I think for me, when I do the up and down roller coaster ride, it’s the down that really is the most important. It’s like the failure is what creates the success, right? So without feeling like crap, without feeling like oh my god, I just want to quit, and realizing that this is a test from the universe. And it’s a test to yourself to see how resilient you are and how we will survive, right? We are stronger than we think we are. I’ve I realized that it’s one minute at a time sometimes. For me, it’s not even just one day at a time, because sometimes that’s overwhelming. It’s one hour at a time. It’s literally just right now, which focuses me to stay present.
As far as my wellness journey goes, I have a therapist, and I’m such a huge advocate for therapy. I understand that not everybody can afford it. But it is important to also not just go to a friend or a family member, you want to go to someone who’s not biased, right? If you’re ready for it. Therapy has been instilled in my body and in my lifestyle because of the time when I got sexually molested as a little girl. My mom made sure I was in therapy right away. And then it was up to me when I moved here to Los Angeles, when I was 22. It was like season four or five that I was like, uh-oh, I definitely need to go and talk to somebody. That was the start of my partying journey. And for me, I love it because I’m a very curious person. Curiosity makes me want to wake up in the morning, because I just really love learning.
There was a moment on “Dancing with the Stars” where I was like, I don’t think I can continue doing this anymore. Because I didn’t feel like I was learning anything, I just felt like I was on autopilot. And there’s nothing worse for me than feeling like I’m stagnant. At the end of the day, I was just craving to learn something. So when we added the Argentine Tango to the show, I went to Argentina, I learned how to tango, and it fed my soul. And now I’m like that with my brain and my intelligence. Just little things, like learning that we’re not our thoughts. I wish I learned that in grade school. There’s a lot of things that I wish we would have learned in school. But anyway, moving to the present moment. It’s fascinating. Continuous growth is what I just yearn for, and I’m so eager to learn.
Carrie Ann: I wonder if it’s because dancers are always in motion, right? We might be more aware when we are feeling stagnant, because we are really tapped into our kinesthetic awareness.
Cheryl Burke: Oh, 100%. Because we feel that we’re very in tune with our bodies, but do we listen to our body? I’m currently doing Somatic Experiencing therapy, and then I’ve got my regular therapist. What Somatic therapy has taught me is to not push through when your body tells you to stop. And that’s what we’re all so good at as dancers – like we sprained an ankle, oh, well. I got another ankle, let’s just keep it moving. Now I’m learning how to feel my feelings. And I know that sounds real basic, but it is basic. And that’s okay. I would rather feel my feelings than not, because I know people that keep their feelings inside. I grew up with an Asian mother, who taught me that vulnerability equaled weakness. It’s not courageous. And it has been definitely an eye opener and scary as shit. It’s been really scary for me to be vulnerable, and to figure out, what does that mean? What does that look like for Cheryl? And trying not to set expectations that are too high, trying not to judge my feelings.
But back to what you were saying about body language. I believe that there’s so many different types of therapy out there – you don’t need to just do talk therapy. You don’t have to sit there in front of a stranger and talk – I understand that some people can’t. A family member of mine, who also got sexually molested by the same man, cannot talk about it. I think there’s animals, there’s movement, and I’m creating a dance program, hopefully launching this year, called Body Language. It combines movement and mental health, which is a real thing that works. I only know from experience, which is why I have a partner who’s a certified therapist that can back it up with science.
Carrie Ann: You know, it’s so true. My first experience of dance was when I was four years old. We ran around in an open air pavilion in Hawaii, and it wasn’t labeled as dance, it was more just expression. Everyone has to move. When you look into the science of it, energy has to move, and our bodies need to express ourselves. I worked with an organization a while ago called Drea’s Dream, and it’s for pediatric cancer movement therapy. It’s really powerful because our body never lies, right? And I think, as a judge, whenever I’m watching, I can learn so much about a person. It informs the critiques that I give to people, because it doesn’t lie. I can tell when somebody’s really tense, I can tell when somebody’s really scared. That’s why I’m always encouraging people to shake it off or to push it far enough that they fall. Once you get past that point, it’s so much easier. Is that a part of the new program that you’re starting with somatic movement?
Cheryl Burke: Yeah, I eventually want all different types or styles of dance. But obviously, I’m an expert in ballroom and I know from firsthand experience that it helped me from when I was sexually abused, to when I was dating abusive men. At the end of the day, the reason why I’m sitting here with you now is because of movement. I cannot discredit that. What I’ve learned so far from Dr. Peter Levine, who started this whole somatic intelligence talk, is that movement helps you shake off trauma. Dr. Levine went to Africa, and long story short, studied the animals and how they shake things off. As it turns out, when they shake it off, they’re actually shaking off trauma so that they don’t continue to keep PTSD in their body. So, Body Language is not going to be about choreography or exercise. It’s literally just bringing out the character of each dance. So we go back and relive that trauma, then we shake it off. And we are intentional about what it is that we want to shake off. For example, if we got into a car accident, and were able to get out of the car and literally shake it off, we would never have to experience the PTSD that most people have experienced. And are still experiencing, myself included.
Carrie Ann: Right, because the muscles contract. I’ve done a little work on this, because I’ve had extreme pain from trauma. When we have traumatic experiences, our body tenses, and then if we don’t release the tension, those neural pathways grow tight. If we start to experience anything similar, or in the range of something similar, we will have the same reaction. So your body will overreact, and that’s the PTSD that you’re talking about. But when you shake it off, you don’t allow those pathways to harden. I think this is going to be so great, it’s going to help a lot of people. People don’t necessarily have to understand with their mind what’s happening. This is another entryway for people who don’t want to talk, right? They don’t want to do talk therapy, they don’t want to use their mind. They just want to absorb it and heal.
(Laughing) They’re not like you and I, who are going to read 97,000 books.
Cheryl Burke: And overanalyze it all and take notes.
Who else is excited to try Cheryl’s somatic movement Therapy class when it’s available? She has come up with such a fun, creative concept that opens the door to new healing modalities. The journey to wellness isn’t one size fits all, and that is why we like to highlight many approaches here at CAC. Healing is personal, and sometimes traditional methods may not work for you. Maybe movement therapy is just the thing you’ve been missing! Let us know what you think in the comments, and if anything in particular from this conversation resonated with you.
To watch Carrie Ann’s full interview with Cheryl, click here.
For more information on Cheryl and her loungewear line, follow the links below:
Born and raised in Hawaii, Isaac is a celebrity trainer, choreographer and Broadway dancer with a long list of credits to his name. While using his experience crafting routines on the main stages of the pop music world and training artists to sculpt their bodies in preparation for their demanding projects, Isaac created TORCH’D, a sustainable workout that burns fat, builds stamina and achieves visible results. Celebrities such as KELLY RIPA, VANESSA HUDGENS, LISA RINNA, JESSICA CHASTAIN, GWYNETH PALTROW, NAOMI WATTS, FAYE DUNAWAY, and LUCY LIU are just a few longtime devotees of TORCH’D and are never hesitant to give Isaac credit for their superb form and increased energy. In March of 2020, as a result of the pandemic lockdown, Isaac offered his TORCH’D classes everyday for free for the first time on Instagram (@isaacboots) and in just a short time Isaac’s workouts became one of the most followed fitness classes around the world. Not wanting to charge a fee for access to the classes during the pandemic, Isaac instead asked his followers to donate what they could to No Kid Hungry, the charity known for providing millions of meals to kids in need. The request was heartfelt and personal. Isaac, from extremely modest means, grew up on food stamps and was challenged by the stigma associated with it. Astonishingly, after just seven months, Isaac’s effort raised over $1 million for No Kid Hungry, thereby making him the single, largest, individual fundraiser in the organization’s history.
This article is an excerpt from Carrie Ann’s February 24th, 2022 Instagram Live conversation with Isaac Boots. It has been edited for length and clarity.
According to a 2006 study, the National Institutes of Health found that “when people give to charities, it activates regions of the brain associated with pleasure, social connection, and trust, creating a “warm glow” effect”. To put it simply, giving back makes you happy! This phenomena is especially exemplified in our guest Isaac Boots. He radiates warmth and generosity, and uses his platform raise awareness and funds for amazing causes. The butterfly effect was aptly mentioned in this interview, and that’s the perfect way to describe Isaac’s contributions to the world! Take any of his high-energy, crazy-fun workout classes, and you won’t be able resist forking over cash to one of the charities Isaac is so passionate about. Endorphins + giving = pure happiness. In the past two years, Isaac has helped raise $2 million for No Kid Hungry, and it’s easy to see why. We hope you enjoy this interview and getting to know the human butterfly that is Isaac!
Carrie Ann: A lot of people think oh, working out is too much for me to do, I can’t do it. How do we stop the excuses?
Isaac Boots: Everyone has at least a few minutes a day. Period. Do a little bit. What we just did for 10 minutes, it’s not that much, but it’s effective. It works. If you do it every day, you see results and you feel results. That’s why I wanted to create something that had no excuses. You can do it anywhere. And just because I offer a 45 minute workout, that doesn’t mean you have to kill yourself and do the whole thing. Do a little bit. Take a break and come back.
Carrie Ann: You’re at The Colony Hotel in Palm Beach doing Torch’d workouts in person. How’s that going? (This interview is from Feb. 24th, 2022. Check Isaac’s website forhis updated schedule)
Isaac Boots: It’s going crazy. It’s a really, really beautiful community here. A lot of my people from New York and the Hamptons have a house here – they’re here in the winter. So it’s kind of cool. It’s packed. I just did a collaboration with Michael Kors, who came down and did a fashion show. We raised a lot of money for Childhood USA, which helps stop child sex trafficking. It’s a real problem and a real thing. So, Michael and I raised about 50k for that the other day, and it’s been great.
Carrie Ann: I’m so proud of you. This is what’s so spectacular about you. First of all, I’m a fan. When everybody went into lockdown, and everyone was lost and didn’t know where to go – and this goes back to what you were just saying about being able to do Torch’d anywhere – YOU KEPT GOING. You did Torch’d from Instagram, for free. Which, by the way, for all of you who don’t know, you can do any of these workouts – he’s got millions of them and they’re all fantastic. Not only did you keep going by doing your Torch’d workouts, but you encouraged people to donate to No Kid Hungry. And now you’re raising money for Childhood USA.
Isaac Boots: Yes, it’s cool because it was founded by Her Majesty Queen Silvia of Sweden, and it’s actually World Childhood Foundation. The US faction is Childhood USA. I don’t know if anybody knows, but the numbers and rates of child sex trafficking have tripled in the past few years in the US. In every neighborhood, even affluent neighborhoods. It’s in your backyard, and it’s children. So in the last few years we’ve raised nearly $2 million for hungry kids, and now I feel I need to protect them. That’s a real issue, and has been a real passion.
Carrie Ann: Where does that passion come from? You’ve raised nearly $2 million for No Kid Hungry and now you’re going to probably raise more for Childhood USA, because I just know how passionate you are. Where does all this passion come from?
Isaac Boots: I think there’s something to be said for growing up in Hawaii. There’s a sense of community, there’s a sense of giving back. There’s a sense of being grateful for what you eat, for what you take, for what you fish. I had a really tough childhood, I grew up really, really poor. My grandmother was a real big source of light, she was like, the most magnificent Hawaiian mama that everybody just loved. She taught me that you have to have gratitude, and the way to really have it is to be aware of the underdog. And there’s nothing more innocent than a child. And particularly with this new initiative, I think it’s uncomfortable for people to talk about. But people need to talk about it, because it’s not happening somewhere else, it’s actually here. So my husband Jeffrey and I are co-chairs of the Childhood USA Gala, which is happening in May. We’re honoring Ricky Martin, actually, because he’s done a lot of work for this. So raising awareness, raising coins, and finding tactics to really fight it. People can also go to childhood-usa.org to learn more.
Carrie Ann: Everybody go check that out! You know, you were talking briefly about Ohana, that spirit from Hawaii that we both have. When you grow up in Hawaii, there’s a sense of community and it’s not separate from yourself. It’s a part of you. We believe that all things are connected. In this series, Carrie Ann Conversations: Journey to Wellness, we often talk about wellness and how the first step is being aware. You were just mentioning awareness about what’s going on in the world, even though some of us want to turn a blind eye because we don’t have time or whatever it is. But we have to be aware of what’s happening in our own backyard in order for us to heal. The world needs healing.
Isaac Boots: Yeah, you know I’m thinking of what’s going on in the Ukraine now every second. You feel a sense of helplessness, like what do I do? How can I help? I just think that it’s the little actions, it’s talking about it, it’s voting, it’s showing up. Making your voice heard. You may feel like you’re powerless, but it’s not true. It’s not true. We all have the capacity to make change, even if it’s in small, small ways. You know, I read something by Ruth Rosenberg, who is my Kabbalah teacher. She posted something on Instagram and all it said was “let someone go in front of you in the line at the grocery store”. I just thought that was so profound. It seems so simple, but it’s those little things. It’s like a butterfly effect for how you treat yourself and how you talk to other people.
Carrie Ann: Because other people in this world are an extension of you, aren’t they? Some people feel that wellness is a luxury for those who have more money, or have more time or freedom. But the truth is, as you so beautifully pointed out, that you can do good in this world just within your little sphere. I think that when you do good like that, you then feel a little bit bigger and brighter. You’re that ripple, and it keeps going. And your ripple, my friend, has been one of the most beautiful things that I’ve experienced during this pandemic. Whenever I felt lost, I want you to know that I watched you. I was just thinking about the time you did the live with Kelly Ripa and she was sliding all over the floor, and she had Mark set up the lights, and it all just went so terribly. Like quote unquote wrong, but it was the most beautiful thing to me! It was so uplifting, and you raised so much money!
Isaac Boots: I think you can attest to this because you’re good friends with her as well, but Kelly Ripa is like the most down to earth, most real girl. Those are the kinds of people that you want to surround yourself with, and encourage other people to be like. Just go with the flow, be vulnerable, be ridiculous, and take time out of your day to do something good. Something outside of yourself. We can all get caught up, especially in this industry. How are my numbers, how can I get more, I need a contract, I need a new deal. Why did he get that and why didn’t I? It’s a mess. It’s noise. It doesn’t matter. You’re going to get what you’re meant to get anyway. So I always say I don’t have competition, and I don’t say that arrogantly. I don’t have competition because I cannot compete, and no one else can be me. There’s room for everyone to succeed. Janet Jackson is a queen. And that didn’t take away from Madonna. And that didn’t take away from Mariah. They were all queens. Rihanna, Gaga, Beyonce, they’re all different and they’re all amazing. So when you get caught up in that, which a lot of people do, it’s all a lie anyway. It’s an illusion.
Carrie Ann: I’ve watched your fame, and your star has grown very quickly and very brightly – which is well deserved. But, I was wondering if you ever feel pressure? How have you dealt with it? Are you able to just have that thought in your head at all times, or do you slip every once in a while? And when you do, how do you pull it back? I think all people slip once in a while.
Isaac Boots: Yeah, that’s a great question. I have a daily practice of reminding myself of what’s important, and what’s really helped me is to always have the main purpose of my day be whatever charitable initiative I’m working on. It is like 100%, it’s in every conversation, in every email. Then it takes it out of just the desire to receive for myself alone, and I actually tend to magnetize more than you can imagine. When I get caught up in the noise of what other people say around me, I catch myself quick, and I just smile. And I say it is what it is. You know, that’s meant for her, that’s meant for him, and that’s amazing. I am where I am for a reason, and I feel lucky and fortunate to be. That’s the real wellness, that self-talk.
Carrie Ann: Yes, during the course of this whole series, not one of my guests has not mentioned self-talk. Negative self-talk is the poison that we must avoid. It can come from so many different directions and it affects the way we think about ourselves. I’m fascinated by the fact that the way that you’re able to help your self-talk stay positive is through the contribution aspect of life. I thought for sure it might be the physical aspect, because I know that you helped a lot of us get into our physical bodies during lockdown. But I love that your motivation is even deeper than that. I do believe that contribution and taking care of others is one of the most important things in life.
Isaac Boots: That’s why I showed up. When I do a workout, I’m putting in the action that hopefully results in someone donating to the link in my bio. That’s 30 minutes of my time, of keeping my body together, that can help a kid. When I was a kid, $5 was a lot. And now thankfully it isn’t. But I remember him.
Carrie Ann: He’s mentioning $5 because when this started he would be telling us all “It’s just $5! It’s a coffee! You can do it!” during the workouts. And you know what? I watched those numbers grow, and I saw people that maybe didn’t think of themselves as somebody who could contribute in that way do it. And in turn, you gave them the gift of the self-esteem that comes along with giving back.
Isaac Boots: And, just to go back to the physical part, as a dancer and a performer…I have to move. So I don’t think of it as working out, it’s just going back to the studio and keeping it tight. But there are so many people that didn’t work out before, or never worked out a day in their life, that started with Torch’d. Maybe they were embarrassed to go to a gym, or embarrassed to go to class. But now they were home and just sort of able to partake and have a laugh. These people have changed their bodies physically too, which to me is a perk. That’s the cherry on top. The real reward is that they’ve changed their self-talk to something more positive.
Carrie Ann: I just want to talk really quickly about your background. There’s so many people that follow you that are from the dance world. I think dancers, as I think most human beings are, are incredible. And they’re not really fully recognized for their beauty and their talent. From your career as a dancer, what is it that you think you learned as a dancer to help you to get to where you are now?
Isaac Boots: Well, first of all, you were a huge inspiration for me as a kid. Madonna, to me as a child, was very important for many reasons. She was the first person to really be a champion for people like me. I was born in ’80, so people were not really talking about being gay. I grew up in a very conservative Catholic home, but Madonna was talking about all these issues, and she was glamorous and fabulous. I couldn’t afford dance class though, so I learned how to dance, really, from watching her videos over and over again. When you did The Girlie Show in ‘93, I was 12 and I remember learning that a fellow Hawaiian was dancing with the queen. I was like, oh my god, this can happen. It was transformative for me, because as you know, being in Hawaii felt very isolating, particularly at that time. Especially if you didn’t have any money, it was like, well, good luck. And to see you up there, it was on HBO I’ll never forget, opening the show, I was like, oh my God, she’s amazing.
Carrie Ann with Madonna and dancers from The Girlie Show, 1993. Click here to purchase the full concert video on Amazon.
Carrie Ann: That was an amazing job for me too, because I got to work with my idol. Thank you for saying that, it touches me to know that. It baffles my brain to know that I have had a little bit of an effect on your life. I watch you and I’m so impressed with you all the time. But in the same way maybe this Hawaiian girl gave you a little hope to pursue your dreams, you are giving so many people hope. People of all different classes, colors, creeds, genders. I think you represent so many people, and are inspiring so many people. As a fellow sister from Hawaii, I just want to thank you, from the bottom of my heart, for all that you’ve done. You are a spectacular human being, I love you so much.
We hope that something in this interview resonates with you, and would love to hear about it in the comments below! For everyone who wants to know more about Isaac, you can follow him on Instagram or visit his website. And if you’re in the mood for a sweat session, all of his free Torch’d classes are on Instagram! If you’re in Florida and would like to take a class in person, he’s currently at The Colony Hotel in Palm Beach and anyone can sign up for classes! Go to isaacboots.com for more information and to book.
If you want to get involved in his initiative to end child sex trafficking, go to childhood-usa.org.
For more information on Torch’d and how to get involved in Isaac’s latest charitable project, Childhood USA, follow the links below:
Fran Drescher has a reputation for passion and commitment. She received two Emmy and two Golden Globe nominations for her portrayal as the lovable “MissFine” on CBS’s hit series,The Nanny, which she both created and executive produced. She also created, executive produced and starred in the groundbreaking TV Land sitcom,Happily Divorced, which was inspired by her real-life relationship with her gay ex-husband, Peter Marc Jacobson. Fran recently starred in the new NBC sitcom,Indebted, about a Baby Boomer couple who go broke and have to move in with their adult son and his young family. She has worked with many great directors in films such as Rob Reiner’s This is Spinal Tap, to which Fran won Esquire Magazine’s One Minute Oscar, Milos Forman’s Ragtime, and Francis Ford Coppola’s Jack. She also starred in Beautician and the Beast opposite Timothy Dalton. Her famous voice is currently featured in the top-grossing SONY animated feature franchise film,Hotel Transylvania: In her role as Eunice, the wife of Frank Stein. In 2019, Fran starred in two indie films,The Creatress and After Class. She currently serves as the president of SAG-AFTRA.
An accomplished author, Fran received the prestigious NCCS writer’s award for Cancer Schmancer, which, along with Enter Whining, were New York Times Best Sellers. She also penned the celebrated children’s book, Being Wendy. Furthermore, Fran made her Broadway debut as “Madame” in Rodgers +Hammerstein’s Tony-Award winning Cinderella. Fran is a 20+-year cancer survivor and founder of the Cancer Schmancer Movement; dedicated to educating, motivating, and activating patients into medical consumers by connecting lifestyle to disease with her Master Class Health Summit and teen-targeted education video, Be The Change, starring Jamie Foxx.
This article is an excerpt from my Feb. 10th, 2022 Instagram Live conversation with Fran Drescher. The interview has been edited for clarity and format. To watch the full video,click here.
The home is a sanctuary, a place where we feel safe and at peace. Many of us focus solely on the look of our homes, tailoring them to reflect our personalities and energies. It’s helpful to have our living spaces project exactly how we want to feel inside them, but there’s a component missing to that equation. As important as it is to carefully construct a comfortable space, it is equally important to be mindful of the products we use in our homes. Some chemicals found in everyday products can be harmful to us and exacerbate or cause health issues. This is completely in opposition to the idea of creating a safe, peaceful environment to live in. So, how do we know which products are harmful? How can we start becoming more mindful about the products we use? I caught up with self-taught expert and all around wonderful human, Fran Drescher, to give you the answers. Fran is a cancer survivor and has made it her personal mission to not only advocate for safer products, but teach people how they can lead a more natural life. Fran is the definition of walking the walk, and I’m so grateful to her for sharing these tips.
The products mentioned in this article are suggestions from the Carrie Ann Conversations team based on Fran’s advice.
Switch to aluminum free deodorant and limit use of aluminum foil
“It should not have aluminum in it. I have found that people with brain diseases like Alzheimer’s have tremendous amounts of aluminum in their body. I actually don’t use aluminum foil to cook anymore, because it gives off noxious fumes that are not healthy. You have to line it with parchment paper if you need to use it, but I don’t. I grew up with my dad barbecuing and wrapping up big potatoes and corn on the cob in foil. But he has Parkinson’s, and a lot of his friends have dementia. And that’s actually not normal. It’s not something that comes with age, it comes with an environmental exposure”.
Turn off your WiFi and electronics periodically
“I installed as an on off switch next to my bed. The last thing I do is turn off the WiFi. I can sleep all night without those electromagnetic fields buzzing around my head and discombobulating my natural energy field, which is in perfect harmony with the earth’s energy fields”.
Buy organic
“The food in my house is always organic. I realize that organic can be more expensive, though it’s readily available at Costco or Walmart. But I would rather have an organic chicken once a week and eat vegetarian, stuff like rice and beans, the rest of the week”.
Find non-toxic candles or use essential oil diffusers
“Don’t use anything that has long lasting smells. I see these commercials. I don’t want to name names but they show people spraying the carpet and spraying the couches right next to the family dog. They’re saying this cleans the air and clears the air. That’s BS. It’s full of phthalates, which mask the air. The more you expose yourself to products that have smells to them, the more you’re asking for a lot of problems including bladder cancer. When I’m in an Uber or something and they’ve got that pine thing hanging from the rearview mirror, I ask them to put it in the glove compartment. I can’t even smell it. It’s so horrible. Once you detach yourself, you won’t be able to use things like that, or candles. Or plugin room deodorizers, or sprays for your furniture. You won’t be able to put those things in your laundry that are supposed to make it smell like springtime. It’s all it’s all carcinogens and toxins. It’s eroding your immune system, and aiding and abetting in your getting ill”.
Make your own natural cleaning solution
“We refill plastic bottles that were once filled with Seven Generation – which is eco-friendly – with white vinegar and peppermint essential oil. Peppermint oil is antibacterial. You can also use alcohol with peppermint essential oil. Or do lemon and water. Tea tree oil is good too; it’s anti-bacterial. And baking soda. You can use it for scrubbing if you mix it with a little bit of water and lemon juice. And it’s so much cheaper, that way you can make up for paying a little extra for organic food. You can reduce your expenses by not buying all of this stuff”.
Switch to a natural, non-toxic toothpaste
“If you’re still using a toothpaste that says on the back “do not swallow”, or “call poison control”, you’ve got to walk away from that toothpaste. How counterintuitive is it that I’m brushing my teeth every day, and they’re saying that it has chemicals in it that are toxic? I use a toothpaste that actually has prebiotics in it to help support the microbiome in my mouth. We have to start thinking about that and realizing that the mouth is connected to the whole body. It’s not a separate anomaly. The mouth is the beginning of your digestive system and the gateway to disease”.
As you can see, Fran has so much knowledge from personal experience and the extensive research she’s done. She is such a bright light in this world and is working to change the way we approach health and wellness. If you would like to take a deeper dive into detoxing your home or learn about the Cancer Schmancer movement, please visit her website! Be kind and stay well.
For more information on Fran Drescher and her work, visit the links below:
Michelle is the author of Exercise For Your Muscle Type: the Smart Way to Get Fit and creator of Prevention Magazine’s ULTIMATE FLAT BELLY DVD series. She currently runs Lovitfitness, a Beverly Hills based training company that is known for getting clients in remarkable shape. Her background in Exercise Physiology is why her methodology and results reside in heart rate based training. Michelle’s signature training method, Train Smarter Not Harder, gives her clients educational tools that help them understand their bodies, lose body fat, get stronger, stay motivated and enjoy a better quality of life. She has a loyal following and a reputation for getting her clients in remarkable shape.
What is intermittent fasting? Is it safe to do, or another dangerous diet fad? It’s become such a hot topic over the last few years, and the word fasting can intimidate a lot of people. But what does fasting actually mean in this context? As it turns out there are a lot of misconceptions about intermittent fasting and its intensity. I asked my friend and personal trainer Michelle Lovitt for all of the answers, and she delivered! Get the details on intermittent fasting and how to make it work for you and your lifestyle in our conversation below. And of course, please consult your doctor before making changes to your diet or fitness routine.
This is an excerpt from my Instagram Live conversation with Michelle Lovitt on Feb. 3, 2022. It has been edited for length and clarity. For our full conversation, click here.
Carrie Ann: Joining me today is someone who knows a lot about fitness. She’s incredible. She’s a personal trainer to stars like Courtney Cox, Alicia Vikander, Amber Valletta, plus many more. And I’m going to include me in that list, even though I don’t really think of myself as a star. She’s also a nutrition coach, an author, and basically a physical health guru. She is amazing. Okay, Michelle, I’m going to ask you this right off the bat. It’s a hot topic, people are wanting to know about it. What is intermittent fasting and does it work?
Michelle Lovitt: Intermittent fasting has been around forever. It’s what our ancestors used to do when they were out chasing down buffalo and bears. It is basically timed eating, rather than eating throughout the day, having a set time that you eat. Whether it’s 7 to 7, 10 to 6, there are different fasting levels. But fasting is so important and so good for your body because it actually reduces cortisol levels, which is the stress hormone in your body. Because it’s not being fed constant fuel, whether it be carbohydrates, protein, or fat, it’s actually utilizing stored body fat through these random crazy processes. You know me and my big words – gluconeogenesis. This process is breaking down body fat and little amino acids from protein for energy sources. It actually helps clear brain fog, and helps us lose body fat more efficiently, more effectively. There are different apps that keep you timely with it, so that when that buzzer goes off, you know your eating is done until the next period or the next day. So it really helps keep you accountable. And it always reminds you to drink water, which is a huge, huge thing as well. So intermittent fasting and hydration go a long way and they go together, hand in hand.
Carrie Ann: Oh, I love that. You know, I never even thought about intermittent fasting and then making sure that you’re getting enough hydration along the way. And I just want to ask you – can you work out when you’re fasting?
Michelle Lovitt: What you don’t want to do is do like a high intensity interval training type of workout. Because when you are in a fasted state your body is basically out of glucose. Your body can store two and a half hours’ worth of energy coming from glucose, which is called glycogen – that’s what your muscles hold onto. So once that glycogen is gone, your body will go into body fat and muscle tissue. So if you are doing high intensity interval training, or really hard workouts, your body doesn’t have the fuel from sugar, so it’s going to go into breaking down muscle tissue. So if you want to build those big, big, strong muscles, you’re not going to be able to do that. But if you want to lose body fat, you can do more of an aerobic, slower intensity type of workout and get amazing results with that.
Carrie Ann: Oh, that’s amazing.
Michelle Lovitt: You don’t have to get out of breath either, so you can actually talk to your friends. So it’s good.
Carrie Ann: So how long is the time period, I just want to make sure everybody understands what intermittent fasting is. How long of a time period is recommended if you’re going to do it?
Michelle Lovitt: Well, it depends on what you’re looking for. But some people can go with a 20 hour fast and only a 4 hour eating period, which is, it’s insane. It’s crazy for a lot of people. But that works for some people. What I have found in working with my clients, and seeing and reading different researchers’ reports, is that 18 / 6 is usually something that’s doable for people. Or 16 / 8. So if you go 16 hours without eating, and you eat for 8 hours, that’s basically eating from 10 o’clock in the morning until 6 o’clock in the afternoon. And I don’t mean eating, like, oh my god, I only get eight hours to eat, so I’m gonna eat everything. Make healthy choices, eat a lot of fruits and vegetables, and hydrate. That also helps with the feelings of being hungry and all of that. It’s a quick way to lose body fat, and maintain muscle mass. And it’s not hard to do. Mentally it is, until you’ve done it for a couple of days. And then you’re like, oh, it’s not that bad. I actually feel better. I’m actually thinking clearer. I think everybody should give it a go, give it a try once and see if you like it.
Carrie Ann: You know, I’ve been doing it, and I like it. It’s made a big difference. It was kind of scary when you said 18 / 6. Because I’m like, what does that mean? It sounds very intimidating. But when you start to think about it, or 16 / 8, I actually like that version better, then you can eat during normal hours. And it’s not that intimidating. I think it’s just a scary idea, the word fasting makes it sound intimidating. But it sounds like a great way and it’s been working.
Michelle: My sister tried it, and I gave her an app to follow. And she was like when the app binged I knew I couldn’t have food anymore, but I would get up and still go look in the refrigerator. She said the only difference is that when she opened the refrigerator, she knew she couldn’t take anything out of it. Whereas before it was just mindless, you just take something out and eat it. And your body doesn’t need that many calories, especially if you’re not getting out and being active.
So what do you think? Is intermittent fasting for you? Leave a comment below if you learned something new or want more videos and articles with Michelle! You can view our full conversation on my Instagram pages, @carrieanninaba@carrieannconversations for more on all things fitness and even a live demonstration of some core strengthening moves. Be kind and stay well!
For more information on Michelle and her training techniques, follow the links below:
We use cookies to personalize content and ads, to provide social media features, and to analyze our traffic. By continuing to use our site, you agree to our terms and conditions and privacy policy.OKPrivacy policy
